Mowing with intermittent GPS

Support & Solutions GPS Issues
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I was under the impression that Yarbo could work, at least temporarily, while under tree canopy utilizing some of the other onboard sensors. e.g., As long as it’s getting good GPS most of the time, it could operate in difficult areas using vision and wheel distance sensors. Like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zf5hGsdId00

I’m seeing that in places with reasonably open sky but next to a treeline that it sometimes looses GPS and then asks me to go move it into an open area before resuming. This interrupts mowing (and me) to go try to adjust it’s location and then it goes back where it was and starts again.

Are the any tips/tricks/settings that need to be adjusted for this to work like that?

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We’re sorry to hear about the issue you’re experiencing. For areas where Yarbo loses GPS signal, you can set those locations as no-go zones to ensure smooth operation. We will continue to improve Yarbo’s performance in areas with weak GPS signals. Our long-term goal is to make Yarbo fully automatic with minimal human intervention. Thank you for your understanding!

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There are no tips or tricks here. It can use the IMU and other sensors when GPS is poor or there is a loss or RTCM. Essentially there is a buffer of about 30 seconds and it loses accuracy over time and distance traveled. One day the hope is VSLAM will negate the need for GPS in these areas (and all over). For now, most of the time if you just wait, the rover will recover GPS on its own and continue on its way without any intervention from you. The message is a little misleading that you need to actually do something. Wait 15-20 mins at most and if it doesn’t recover on its own, drive it out to an open area and then hit resume. It should continue on and most likely will be able to continue past the last pause point.

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Thanks Bryan. I think that makes sense and sets near term realistic expectations.

Making them no go-zones just means I’d need to manually mow. Hopefully VSLAM and other enhancements will come sooner rather than later.

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Having some of the same issues. Even trying to map the yard. So I can begin to work. Follow me is working great. GPS is failing. I have the best signal at the DC. I figured the HALO would help with this issue. I have to keep going back never to get the map up and going. Can this be mapped any other way? 4G, Hot spot. Me walking right behind the mower, with Bluetooth on? When I pull up the main page, I don’t even see the Halo lit up. Just GPS going in and out. It can see my Yarbo, but doesn’t see RTK Base when I do location? Keeps saying failed toget address?

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RTK shows 25 Sats, @ -404 Latency. Strong Network. Location when I mounted the DC was Excellent all green. HaLow says True @Signal -49 APP. 3.15.1 and Firmware is 3.8.18. Evenything set up great. Was wondering if it was because of the cloudy weather, or even the impact of the dust storms going over the SE US right now.

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The rover has GPS antennas too. It has to see the same satellites as the data center. You don’t need line of sight to the DC for it to work, but you do need HaLow signal or cellular to receive the correction data stream from the Data Center. The DC is the fixed reference point that your rover uses to determine its actual position relative to the fixed position. There is really no other way to accomplish this. They both have to see the same satellites. And they need precision satellites to work. That is the L2 satellites. You need a minimum of 4 in theory but in practicality you need 10+ (because the odds are that both the DC and rover aren’t going to see the same 10 consistently). This is why the higher L2, the better. Then you have Heading DOP. This is what they call multi path error or Dilution Of Precision (DOP). This is the amount of obstructions, reflections, etc that is messing with the timing of the signal. Time is important, and a reflection can mess with the timing accuracy making the rover think it’s somewhere it really isn’t. This is again why having more satellites is important so that it can use the more accurate ones in aggregate to figure out what is right vs delayed. You want Heading DOP to be less than 1 ideally. This number fluctuates a lot. As long as you are consistently below 1.5 your are OK. Anything over that and you are probably going into float mode. This is RTK status 5 (dm level accuracy). This is when it starts relying on the other sensors and starts drifting off course until it either stops completely and waits for GPS to recover, or GPS recovers and it corrects course when it obtains RTK Status 4 (cm level accuracy)

Your latency seems to be the issue. This is the RTCM or the correct data stream. It needs to be 15 or less. Normally 1-2.

Did you connect your rover to your home wifi? If so, that could be the issue. There is a known bug with doing so and it’s not recommended. The other possibility is that your phone could be switching back and forth from WiFi to Bluetooth and Cellular. Try disabling bluetooth and wifi on your cell phone temporarily and see if you have a more stable connection. The app represents the switch as a loss of GPS and will show latency until it reconnects with the rover through another communications method.

If none of that is true or works, then it might be something else. HaLow status TRUE with a -49 is fantastic signal and you should not be having an issue. Can you post your diagnostics screenshot? Include the Rover, Status, Data Center, and HaLow sections. You can omit the GPS coordinates.

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Thanks, No WiFi connected. BlueTooth either.

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Your data center appears to be in local mode. That usually means it doesn’t have internet access. Have you tried power cycling it or checking that it has a link light and is working on your home router?

Also, is your data center firmware updated to v1.0.25?

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I have you tried power cycling it. Green light is blinking and is working on your home router? Firmware is updated to v1.0.25. I’ll try powering down again. Light on DC is solid green out side. HaLo is Green and solid with BlueTooth off. GPS off and on. More on with Halo and Bluetooth off. Anything with the router settings maybe to change?

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Do you see Data Latency creep up from 1 to 180 or whatever, then AdjustAngle pops to -2? Data Latency may also go -404, seen that, too.

Unplug your Data Center from your router – not the PoE injector – and see what happens.

If it does another Data Latency run up to some number but then settles back and everything runs great, you’ve got a network issue, something I’ve been chasing here.

Is your Data Center on a WiFi Extender?

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With the DC unplugged from the router. No Bluetooth, no WiFi. I’m seeing. Data Latency staying @ 1. Adjust Angle staying @0. HeadingDop is the main thing I’m seeing moving very much 1.2-1.3 now. still over 20+ Satellites. HaLow signal @ -56. Data Center is not on a WiFi Extender. Should it be? Thanks for any help.

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Data Latency does run up to some number but then settles back to -404. Then starts back up.
But like I said Data Center is not on a WiFi Extender. Hard wire right out of my router, then in the PoE injector. Then out with the supplied cord to DC. DC stays solid Green.

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Uh ohh, @dandbstephens, you might be my new BFF. That’s NOT a good thing, trust me. :rofl:

Nope, please don’t do the WiFi Extender thing – it’s actually not recommended, but folks do it. If your Data Center is plugged right into your router as close as possible to your Internet feed, keep it right there.

The difference between my situation and yours is I have a WiFi Extender hanging off a Fidium WiFi setup, and the 2.4GHz signal getting to my WiFi Extender looks dodgy and even disruptive to it. You don’t have this configuration, BUT you and I seem to have similar symptoms. You see those numbers like I do in the Diagnostics screen when the rover becomes very much unusable, you get GPS losses, the App loses connectivity, whatever. It gets frustrating.

Yes, the DC stays GREEN through all this. What I think is happening is the Data Center and rover – for whatever reason – are trying to re-negotiate the way they communicate GPS data. It looks like a network problem triggers some kind of GPS communication reset, even if HaLow is OK. But I’m only guessing.

What’s good is that you and I have the same symptoms and sometimes are ready to have our rovers drive themselves into a bonfire, only they’ll stop and not get there when this problem arises. And they’re too heavy to throw.

I am NOT sure what to do, so I just keep poking at it.

My ancient WiFi Extender is fairly broken, but if I have the WiFi radio disabled and use only 5GHz, it works GREAT (for now). I recently replaced it with a brand new WiFi Extender with all the latest and greatest, and it had the rover throwing the symptoms that you and I are seeing. Now THAT is interesting. So is having a 2.4GHz + 5GHz combo network an issue? Is my 2.4GHz network compromised, maybe by my Internet provider’s mesh hardware? I don’t know, and I continue to work on this.

Which is where you come in. You have the symptoms WITHOUT a WiFi Extender.

I’m not really sure where we go from here. I would like to get this understood and resolved. I think I’m OK for now with my broken hardware (go figure!) and can wait for Support to get back on its feet before pestering them with a “live” call. You, though, sound broken, and it’s more urgent.

Thoughts, folks? I think this may take a deeper dive and get even more boring out here.

@dandbstephens…

  • Are there other devices on your router, or what happens if you plug another device into that port? Is everything OK?
  • I guess if you have more details about your network topology – how it comes into the house, what it plugs into, and where it goes from there – we may be able to find a common thread.

Or not. But I’d like to…and put this to bed.

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This is what I’m using. Unleashing Lightning-Fast Internet in Rural Areas with Cudy P5 5G Router: A Complete Review!

We only had slow AT&T DSL @ like 70 bucks. @ 6.0 speeds. 5G I pay 50 and have unlimited, and no slow downs. Speeds over 400, in my area is as fast as city users over fiber. Everything is on WiFi. The only thing that isn’t is the one line going to PoE. Been using this setup for about 2 Years. LOVE IT.

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@dandbstephens Couldn’t be more different from my setup, which is good and bad, I guess! I have Fidium Fiber, they supply a router + “pod” to create a mesh. My WiFi Extender taps into the WiFi network to provide the Ethernet port for the Data Center. So you have ONE WiFi networking device, and it’s 5G (cellular), where I have a couple, and it’s fiber from the street.

Sorry if you mentioned this - did you try unplugging the Data Center from this router and just left that cord dangling, and then watched the rover and the Diagnostics?

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Disconnect the LAN side of your POE injector (unplug from your home router) and see if your data latency stabilizes around 1-3. If it does, it might actually be your router or provider. Enable cellular on the rover as a backup communications method in the event HaLow signal is lost. Just know that in local mode, you will only be able to connect over Bluetooth or cellular to control the rover. This is offline mode, but it should work.

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Nothing plugged into the router. No Wifi on. No BlueTooth. 4G is on the Core.Latency is stable @1. Sats are @26. L2 is 16, Status 4, HaLow -53

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And if you reconnect to your router does the latency increase past 15?

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It does climbs all the time up to -404. Then restarts. When I look at the router, shows line in, and it’s on 2.4GHz. Also if I pull up Find Yarbo. It shows the Core, but Fails to find address of RTK. Yet yesterday, when I had it pulled up to find them, it showed both of them. :thinking: